Namecalling

left There’s a funny thing that happens when you make a list. People want to see if they’re on it. If they are, they feel pleased (or smug, or vindicated, or several other emotions). If they are not, they ask to be on it, they make sidelong comments about not being on it, they wonder if it’s a clique or a “cool kids table” kind of thing from school.

In the case of the list above, it was intended to be helpful. I find it helpful. I found a few other people that I’ve yet to pay attention to that add to the information mix of what we learn about on the web. There are some really great names on there. And then, I’m on there, so it makes me feel good.

It’s the same if you list companies. I, for instance, intend to write up the kinds of social software platforms I recommend most often to people. I know that when I publish the list, I will hear from several companies who feel I surely made a mistake by not including them on the list.

When writing a blog post, sometimes we include people as examples. Sometimes, that’s a flattering thing. Other times, we’re throwing a few extra people under the bus.

When we call names, we exclude. When we don’t, we are too bland and neutral. I don’t think there’s a way to do it without someone feeling offended, excluded or otherwise.

What do you feel when you see lists where you think you belong and you don’t find yourself there? How do you proceed? How do these lists help you, or do they?

Photo credit, foundphotoslj

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  • http://mobatalk.com Michael Bailey

    Oh just do it like the politicians do it – pit the masses against the minority and then sleep well at night.

    You can not/will not ever be able to please everyone. People are too dynamic.

  • http://memyselfandjonna.blogspot.com Jonna

    Every person has their own reasons for including and excluding people/companies/etc on lists, and as much as I would love to be included on some great lists (like BlogWorld guest list please! LOL), unless you are just really popular and a jack-of-all-trades, it’s more likely you will be left off most of them.
    So, the way I handle it, is to see what the others on the list are doing right and how I can help my chances of being included next time!

  • http://mobatalk.com Michael Bailey

    Oh just do it like the politicians do it – pit the masses against the minority and then sleep well at night.

    You can not/will not ever be able to please everyone. People are too dynamic.

  • http://memyselfandjonna.blogspot.com Jonna

    Every person has their own reasons for including and excluding people/companies/etc on lists, and as much as I would love to be included on some great lists (like BlogWorld guest list please! LOL), unless you are just really popular and a jack-of-all-trades, it’s more likely you will be left off most of them.
    So, the way I handle it, is to see what the others on the list are doing right and how I can help my chances of being included next time!

  • http://www.afpr.com Andy Finkle

    For me, it is not about being on or off a list (albeit truth be told, don’t we all want to be on the good lists :-) ). My pet peeve is when I reach out to someone (perhaps in the hopes of getting on a list), and do not receive the courtesy of a reply.

    Like all here, I get hundreds of emails in my inbox everyday. People throw sheep at me on Facebook, ask me questions on linkedin and @ me on Twitter. I realize just how precious time is. I always mange to reply though.

    I believe we have entered a period of time when courtesy has been thrown out the window. I would ask the question how do YOU feel when people do not reply? It is not exactly the same question that you ask, but I believe it entails the same feelings one gets when they are not on the list.

    http://www.twitter.com/A_F

  • http://www.afpr.com Andy Finkle

    For me, it is not about being on or off a list (albeit truth be told, don’t we all want to be on the good lists :-) ). My pet peeve is when I reach out to someone (perhaps in the hopes of getting on a list), and do not receive the courtesy of a reply.

    Like all here, I get hundreds of emails in my inbox everyday. People throw sheep at me on Facebook, ask me questions on linkedin and @ me on Twitter. I realize just how precious time is. I always mange to reply though.

    I believe we have entered a period of time when courtesy has been thrown out the window. I would ask the question how do YOU feel when people do not reply? It is not exactly the same question that you ask, but I believe it entails the same feelings one gets when they are not on the list.

    http://www.twitter.com/A_F

  • http://mobatalk.com Michael Bailey

    @AndyFinkle – oh man, it gets even worse when you call someone out for ignoring you and that even goes unanswered.
    http://mobatalk.com/twitter/videos/directview.php?id=eweTTut&tag=JasonCalacanis

  • http://mobatalk.com Michael Bailey

    @AndyFinkle – oh man, it gets even worse when you call someone out for ignoring you and that even goes unanswered.
    http://mobatalk.com/twitter/videos/directview.php?id=eweTTut&tag=JasonCalacanis

  • http://www.julieannebonner.com Julie Bonner

    For me personally, if a list comes out and I’m not on it but I feel I should be, it makes me want to do better. It gives me that little extra push to strive for more. I step back, take a look at things and say “okay, what do I need to change?”

    You are right Chris, there isn’t a way to do it without offending someone. But the offended people need to chill and possibly re-evaluate things.

  • http://www.julieannebonner.com Julie Bonner

    For me personally, if a list comes out and I’m not on it but I feel I should be, it makes me want to do better. It gives me that little extra push to strive for more. I step back, take a look at things and say “okay, what do I need to change?”

    You are right Chris, there isn’t a way to do it without offending someone. But the offended people need to chill and possibly re-evaluate things.

  • http://www.ambeck.com Avil Beckford

    Social media and blogging is fairly new to me and I am learning. I do not expect to be on any list, but I look at what others who are on the list to see what they are doing and perhaps learn from them.

    I can understand how people will feel slighted because it’s human nature. When you start to call names you will run into problems, but there is no way around it. It’s the same thing if people worked on planning an event and you had sponsors and at the event you forgot to thank a key sponsor or the chair of the organizing committee, oops. These things happen and you can always apologize if you forgot someone who really should have been on the list.

    twitter.com/avilbeckford

  • http://www.ambeck.com Avil Beckford

    Social media and blogging is fairly new to me and I am learning. I do not expect to be on any list, but I look at what others who are on the list to see what they are doing and perhaps learn from them.

    I can understand how people will feel slighted because it’s human nature. When you start to call names you will run into problems, but there is no way around it. It’s the same thing if people worked on planning an event and you had sponsors and at the event you forgot to thank a key sponsor or the chair of the organizing committee, oops. These things happen and you can always apologize if you forgot someone who really should have been on the list.

    twitter.com/avilbeckford

  • http://simplelivingrevolution.com/ Sandra

    Never gave it a lot of thought. You definitely can’t please everyone and nobody would read a never ending list anyway.

  • http://simplelivingrevolution.com/ Sandra

    Never gave it a lot of thought. You definitely can’t please everyone and nobody would read a never ending list anyway.

  • http://www.brandonmulnix.com Brandon Mulnix

    Chris,

    The reason you are on so many lists is because you speak the truth. You are honest about the topics you are talking about. I know what its like to be left out of things that I would really like to be part of. Instead of complaining I work harder to make the connections it takes to get on those lists. I am a new to most of the areas that I feel I should be recognized for, but I forget all about that when the list comes out.
    For me its in the photography world. I have been to small 10 studio schools where the instructor will pick out one person who for the next few months she will talk about to everyone. The example for us was about blogging. The instructor picked out a photographer who had only been blogging for about 6 months and called her the expert on blogging in the group. Not once were we mentioned and we had been blogging for over a year and actually could help others set up their own. She didn’t set hers up, someone else did.
    We get reminded of this monthly when we see this studio now doing webinars on a national level about how to blog and why they are so successful at it.

    People as a whole can only be in so many right places at so many times, but they have to keep trying. It will pay off if you do know what you are talking about.

    Keep up the great posts
    Brandon

  • http://www.brandonmulnix.com Brandon Mulnix

    Chris,

    The reason you are on so many lists is because you speak the truth. You are honest about the topics you are talking about. I know what its like to be left out of things that I would really like to be part of. Instead of complaining I work harder to make the connections it takes to get on those lists. I am a new to most of the areas that I feel I should be recognized for, but I forget all about that when the list comes out.
    For me its in the photography world. I have been to small 10 studio schools where the instructor will pick out one person who for the next few months she will talk about to everyone. The example for us was about blogging. The instructor picked out a photographer who had only been blogging for about 6 months and called her the expert on blogging in the group. Not once were we mentioned and we had been blogging for over a year and actually could help others set up their own. She didn’t set hers up, someone else did.
    We get reminded of this monthly when we see this studio now doing webinars on a national level about how to blog and why they are so successful at it.

    People as a whole can only be in so many right places at so many times, but they have to keep trying. It will pay off if you do know what you are talking about.

    Keep up the great posts
    Brandon

  • http://www.smalldots.wordpress.com Beth Dunn

    If there’s one thing I’ve learned lately, it’s that people aren’t mind-readers. But they are usually remarkably willing to listen if you speak up. So when I see a list that I think I should be on, I say something. Sitting around, nursing a perceived slight is not helping me OR the people who might like to hear about me, assuming they exist.

    So I speak up. This world is a pretty big place, and you have to speak up and introduce yourself over and over and over again. Good news is, you get better at it with practice.

  • http://www.smalldots.wordpress.com Beth Dunn

    If there’s one thing I’ve learned lately, it’s that people aren’t mind-readers. But they are usually remarkably willing to listen if you speak up. So when I see a list that I think I should be on, I say something. Sitting around, nursing a perceived slight is not helping me OR the people who might like to hear about me, assuming they exist.

    So I speak up. This world is a pretty big place, and you have to speak up and introduce yourself over and over and over again. Good news is, you get better at it with practice.

  • http://mobatalk.com Michael Bailey

    @BethDunn That is some great advice, and a healthy attitude to have. We can only trust that they do exist, and keep on trying.

  • http://mobatalk.com Michael Bailey

    @BethDunn That is some great advice, and a healthy attitude to have. We can only trust that they do exist, and keep on trying.

  • http://chrisbrogan.com chrisbrogan

    @Andy – Interesting question to ask. Let me answer it for myself. Over the last 9 days, I was in five different cities. For the last five of the nine, I wasn’t in the same place for more than 24 hours. I went from having Inbox Zero to Inbox 491. I’m still trying to weed through.

    So, for me personally, no, I can’t reply to every email any longer. It’s not sheep and other bacn. It’s all actionable stuff that people want thoughtful responses to, and I can’t answer them all. There’s no staff here. Just a dude with a family, a day job, and several thousand passionate friends.

    I try, and I get there eventually, but it just doesn’t scale. Still working on how to scale it up.

    Tim Ferriss from Four Hour Work Week got back to me a week or so after I emailed him, and that felt reasonable to me. He’s a NY Times Bestseller list guy, so he’s got even larger scale issues.

    As time goes on, we’ll figure it out. Great point to raise, Andy.

  • http://chrisbrogan.com chrisbrogan

    @Andy – Interesting question to ask. Let me answer it for myself. Over the last 9 days, I was in five different cities. For the last five of the nine, I wasn’t in the same place for more than 24 hours. I went from having Inbox Zero to Inbox 491. I’m still trying to weed through.

    So, for me personally, no, I can’t reply to every email any longer. It’s not sheep and other bacn. It’s all actionable stuff that people want thoughtful responses to, and I can’t answer them all. There’s no staff here. Just a dude with a family, a day job, and several thousand passionate friends.

    I try, and I get there eventually, but it just doesn’t scale. Still working on how to scale it up.

    Tim Ferriss from Four Hour Work Week got back to me a week or so after I emailed him, and that felt reasonable to me. He’s a NY Times Bestseller list guy, so he’s got even larger scale issues.

    As time goes on, we’ll figure it out. Great point to raise, Andy.

  • http://www.WaxingUnLyrical.com Shonali Burke, ABC

    If it’s one I care about, and really believe I should be on, I pay attention to the process that’s required to get on the list – and then I give it my best shot. I have no qualms about pulling in friends/supporters if that’s going to bolster it.

    I do think two things that make a difference in making/not making such lists are:

    1) How you position yourself on a day-to-day basis, because that adds up to your public presence (and why you should/shouldn’t be on the list) over time; and
    2) Having a presence with the “movers and shakers” of that particular space. In the old days it was called networking (sometimes it still is!), today it’s who your “friends” or “followers” are – but it’s still essentially the same thing.

    At the end of the day, the fundamentals of who you are and how you make a difference are what’s going to separate you from the next person. Flash and glitz are never adequate or successful substitutes for substance and truth.

    No matter how many lists there are, there’s always going to be at least one that you’re not on, that you cared about. And when that happens – give in to your rage/grief/whatever, work through it, and move on. Most of the time, it’s just someone’s opinion, right? Not being on “the” list may have wounded your ego, but if you’re still healthy, sane, solvent, have a roof over your head and food on your table, then it didn’t really hurt you, did it? Tomorrow is another day, and will bring more lists that may be better!

  • http://www.linkedin.com/in/shonaliburke Shonali Burke

    If it’s one I care about, and really believe I should be on, I pay attention to the process that’s required to get on the list – and then I give it my best shot. I have no qualms about pulling in friends/supporters if that’s going to bolster it.

    I do think two things that make a difference in making/not making such lists are:

    1) How you position yourself on a day-to-day basis, because that adds up to your public presence (and why you should/shouldn’t be on the list) over time; and
    2) Having a presence with the “movers and shakers” of that particular space. In the old days it was called networking (sometimes it still is!), today it’s who your “friends” or “followers” are – but it’s still essentially the same thing.

    At the end of the day, the fundamentals of who you are and how you make a difference are what’s going to separate you from the next person. Flash and glitz are never adequate or successful substitutes for substance and truth.

    No matter how many lists there are, there’s always going to be at least one that you’re not on, that you cared about. And when that happens – give in to your rage/grief/whatever, work through it, and move on. Most of the time, it’s just someone’s opinion, right? Not being on “the” list may have wounded your ego, but if you’re still healthy, sane, solvent, have a roof over your head and food on your table, then it didn’t really hurt you, did it? Tomorrow is another day, and will bring more lists that may be better!

  • http://TheBlogArtist.com marti garaughty

    hi Chris, we’re dammed if we do and dammed if we don’t. A lot of my online contacts including clients, people I network with, etc… occasionally show up in my posts but only if and when it’s appropriate and adds something to the conversation.

    People who whine and beg for attention sometimes get it but for all the wrong reasons.

  • http://TheBlogArtist.com marti garaughty

    hi Chris, we’re dammed if we do and dammed if we don’t. A lot of my online contacts including clients, people I network with, etc… occasionally show up in my posts but only if and when it’s appropriate and adds something to the conversation.

    People who whine and beg for attention sometimes get it but for all the wrong reasons.

  • http://chrisbrogan.com chrisbrogan

    @marti – you’re right about the whining and begging part.

  • http://chrisbrogan.com chrisbrogan

    @marti – you’re right about the whining and begging part.

  • http://remarkablogger.com Michael Martine, Blog Consulta

    LOL on “throw a few extra people under the bus”. I can see how a person could justify “nominating” someone else besides themselves for inclusion to a list, but to suggest oneself is ego-whining at its best (well, worst, actually).

    Besides, THAT’S WHAT COMMENTS ARE FOR. Just a simple line in the post like: “If you can think of anyone else who should be on this list, please add their name in a comment.”

  • http://remarkablogger.com Michael Martine, Blog Consultant

    LOL on “throw a few extra people under the bus”. I can see how a person could justify “nominating” someone else besides themselves for inclusion to a list, but to suggest oneself is ego-whining at its best (well, worst, actually).

    Besides, THAT’S WHAT COMMENTS ARE FOR. Just a simple line in the post like: “If you can think of anyone else who should be on this list, please add their name in a comment.”

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  • http://chrisbrogan.com chrisbrogan

    That’s how I roll, Michael. But then, you knew that. : )

  • http://chrisbrogan.com chrisbrogan

    That’s how I roll, Michael. But then, you knew that. : )

  • http://nickyjameson.com Nicky

    My first thought when I red your post is that selective lists are, by their very nature exclusive and it’s natural for people to want to feel included and above all recognized. When a list is largely someone’s opinion then it’s probably a waste of energy worrying about why you’re not on it… unless it is really important to you to BE on it and hurts your ego if you’re not.

    I believe there is a way to lessen the potential for “offence” and that is list clearly the parameters for getting on to said list. They don’t seem to be too clear in this one – except that “tech stuff” seems to be a component and “Scoble liking them” another. I found the list interesting because it gave me ideas for people I may check out. Other than that I prefer lists where several people have voted – it lessens the personal slant and seems somehow more equitable. I suspect this list is getting tons of attention because it’s Scoble’s list.

    Having said that, if you really feel you – or someone you know is deserving of being on said list, it does say you can ask for them to be added. Ask nicely now ;) don’t whine and complain.

  • http://nickyjameson.com Nicky

    My first thought when I red your post is that selective lists are, by their very nature exclusive and it’s natural for people to want to feel included and above all recognized. When a list is largely someone’s opinion then it’s probably a waste of energy worrying about why you’re not on it… unless it is really important to you to BE on it and hurts your ego if you’re not.

    I believe there is a way to lessen the potential for “offence” and that is list clearly the parameters for getting on to said list. They don’t seem to be too clear in this one – except that “tech stuff” seems to be a component and “Scoble liking them” another. I found the list interesting because it gave me ideas for people I may check out. Other than that I prefer lists where several people have voted – it lessens the personal slant and seems somehow more equitable. I suspect this list is getting tons of attention because it’s Scoble’s list.

    Having said that, if you really feel you – or someone you know is deserving of being on said list, it does say you can ask for them to be added. Ask nicely now ;) don’t whine and complain.

  • http://nickyjameson.com Nicky

    Oh, and my “red” should be “read.”

  • http://nickyjameson.com Nicky

    Oh, and my “red” should be “read.”

  • http://remarkablogger.com Michael Martine, Blog Consulta

    @Chris – Call me “Captain Obvious”! :)

  • http://remarkablogger.com Michael Martine, Blog Consultant

    @Chris – Call me “Captain Obvious”! :)

  • http://www.joebuddejr.com Joe Budde Jr

    It is sad that brief generalizations rule the world. But for us to attempt to make sense of this illogical world where rational decisions do not reign it is a necessary evil for us to progress as a society.

    A more interesting generalization is the question of Name. Does your name make you a social media sultan? (per Robert)

    Chris, it does for you! And for the Mikes of the world, but it doesn’t for us Joes!

  • http://www.joebuddejr.com Joe Budde Jr

    It is sad that brief generalizations rule the world. But for us to attempt to make sense of this illogical world where rational decisions do not reign it is a necessary evil for us to progress as a society.

    A more interesting generalization is the question of Name. Does your name make you a social media sultan? (per Robert)

    Chris, it does for you! And for the Mikes of the world, but it doesn’t for us Joes!

  • http://nickyjameson.com Nicky

    @Andy – your point is an excellent one.

    In an ideal world each person would reply to every email/question they got, but the more you get the less it’s possible – unless replying to email is your full time job. I also think we have to filter to a large extent.

    I personally think if people have gone to the trouble of emailing you they deserve a reply – their time is important too (sheep and bacon aside, as I simply have no time to be returning sheep or pokes, et al. on FB, while I do respond to messages, posts etc). I tend to reply to all my non-business related email, sometimes within hours if the reply is short, usually within a week, sometimes longer… it depends on the question, but thankfully it’s not coming from thousands of followers and friends, so it’s managable – so far.
    I’ve sent email to people and, depending on my question if it takes up to two weeks to respond it doesn’t bother me. Usually I get a response within a week which I consider pretty good.

    @Chris, here’s something I’ve experienced on a popular developer’s blog… whenever I sent him an email asking a question I got an auto message saying they did appreciate my email, but that due to the volume of email he gets it might be a while before he responded. It set my expectations, and in fact they actually replied in a few hours.

  • http://nickyjameson.com Nicky

    @Andy – your point is an excellent one.

    In an ideal world each person would reply to every email/question they got, but the more you get the less it’s possible – unless replying to email is your full time job. I also think we have to filter to a large extent.

    I personally think if people have gone to the trouble of emailing you they deserve a reply – their time is important too (sheep and bacon aside, as I simply have no time to be returning sheep or pokes, et al. on FB, while I do respond to messages, posts etc). I tend to reply to all my non-business related email, sometimes within hours if the reply is short, usually within a week, sometimes longer… it depends on the question, but thankfully it’s not coming from thousands of followers and friends, so it’s managable – so far.
    I’ve sent email to people and, depending on my question if it takes up to two weeks to respond it doesn’t bother me. Usually I get a response within a week which I consider pretty good.

    @Chris, here’s something I’ve experienced on a popular developer’s blog… whenever I sent him an email asking a question I got an auto message saying they did appreciate my email, but that due to the volume of email he gets it might be a while before he responded. It set my expectations, and in fact they actually replied in a few hours.

  • http://rorowe.blogspot.com Robert Rowe

    Chris, you were also “listed” on the “100+ (E-)Learning Professionals to follow on Twitter” (http://www.c4lpt.co.uk/socialmedia/edutwitter.html) list (I found it via Alec Couros). I do find lists occasionally useful, but just because a creator of a list values someone’s importance (or lack of importance), doesn’t mean their readers do as well, so I take it all with a grain of salt.

  • http://rorowe.blogspot.com Robert Rowe

    Chris, you were also “listed” on the “100+ (E-)Learning Professionals to follow on Twitter” (http://www.c4lpt.co.uk/socialmedia/edutwitter.html) list (I found it via Alec Couros). I do find lists occasionally useful, but just because a creator of a list values someone’s importance (or lack of importance), doesn’t mean their readers do as well, so I take it all with a grain of salt.

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  • http://www.ThisLandisForYou.com Gina Kay Landis

    Oh, I just feel like I’m not as experienced with social/new media as I’d like to be. That said, my time is spent in all sorts of ways, and social/new media is one part of it. I’d like it to be a bigger part, but I don’t currently go to blog events, nor do I have the best/latest/greatest tech equipment. Still working on a blog, but am finding I have so many interests it’s not going to be totally about social/new media, not totally real estate, not totally anything. Kinda like that, though. I’ll continue to investigate social/new media to see how it will help my business and my brokerage, as well as the world at large. Make a splash? I dunno if that’s my goal anyway. Let’s just do what we can and make a difference.

  • http://www.ThisLandisForYou.com Gina Kay Landis

    Oh, I just feel like I’m not as experienced with social/new media as I’d like to be. That said, my time is spent in all sorts of ways, and social/new media is one part of it. I’d like it to be a bigger part, but I don’t currently go to blog events, nor do I have the best/latest/greatest tech equipment. Still working on a blog, but am finding I have so many interests it’s not going to be totally about social/new media, not totally real estate, not totally anything. Kinda like that, though. I’ll continue to investigate social/new media to see how it will help my business and my brokerage, as well as the world at large. Make a splash? I dunno if that’s my goal anyway. Let’s just do what we can and make a difference.

  • http://wesleyism.com Wesley

    I know that I’m not worthy of being on any lists so I’ve never been too bothered about them. I don’t think I’ve ever been on a list in my life.

  • http://wesleyism.com Wesley

    I know that I’m not worthy of being on any lists so I’ve never been too bothered about them. I don’t think I’ve ever been on a list in my life.

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